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We like that the Kerdi membrane material installs easily over almost any substrate, including standard wallboard. Should I redo this wall to avoid a mold sandwich? Cementboard sufficient to a tub surround is dirt cheap .vs. In jobsite conditions and over a long time, who knows. The main types of cement board you could encounter are Fibre Reinforced Cement (FRC) board and gypsum board. Kerdi Vs. RedGard (Compared) - Build It Fine My understanding is that Schluter-Kerdi, being a sheet topical membrane, recommends just going with regular drywall instead of cement board but you can certainly use cement board as the substrate. It installs with screws, then you tape the joints & screw holes and install your tile. To line niche shelves, for instance. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. I've never had a failure. Can I install Kerdi board just on the walls of my shower and use a PVC membrane on the floor? Waterproof showers are the trend today, so RedGard is an excellent alternative to cement boards that act as vapor barriers. ".1) is is okay to use kerdi board instead of ditra on the floor? The niche' intermediate shelf isn't actually attached, to enable specific placement for each unique tiling application. vegan) just to try it, does this inconvenience the caterers and staff? ), Minimising the environmental effects of my dyson brain, Finite abelian groups with fewer automorphisms than a subgroup. Allow the primer to dry completely before proceeding with the KERDI installation. You just need a hammer and wonderbar for the walls. We don't expect people to master this and in fact I know maybe two guys in my area (live in big city) that could do this. Make sure the floor is level in the shower. Sealing the tub flange for tile: 3 methods - DIYTileGuy The 30-in. A lot of folks like using cement board but it's heavy and requires a waterproofing membrane over it. When installing KERDI with . I agree that gypsum seems very questionable anywhere in the wet areas of a shower. Kerdi Membrane not sticking to cement board - John Bridge Kerdi Membrane is a product of Schluter systems. Asking for help, clarification, or responding to other answers. Some being easier to work with than others. Yup! It is easier to cut than cement board, it is mold resistant, and it has a built-in moisture barrier. Both may be effective substrates, but Kerdi Board boasts significant advantages. A good rule of thumb is 24 hours per inch of thickness, then one more day on top of that to be sure. Run a damp towel over the cement board surface to dust . Schluter-KERDI is a pliable, sheet-applied, bonded waterproof membrane and vapor retarder with limited crack-bridging capabilities. While cement board is a reliable tile underlayment, it isnt completely waterproof only water-resistant. Will be replacing tub shower combination with tiled shower in my home. Additionally, all seams should be sealed with Kerdi Fix and covered with fleece. It also helped me to work in smaller sheets. Cement board is a heavy mess compared to drywall, and drywall is a heavy mess compared to Kerdi Board. Portland cement-based unmodified thin-set mortars are dependent on the presence of moisture for hydration in order to gain strength. How did this project turn out? Hardibacker is a VERY "thirsty" material that sucks the moisture out of the mortar VERY quickly and I don't like it. What to use to flatten and prep wall before installing Schluter Kerdi membrane for tiling? While cement board and grout are not waterproof, Kerdi is and can even be directly installed over drywall. You peeled it off? Retired Moderator - Theatre Guy (and computers). And for a more secure fit, you can also use screws. We sponge water onto the cement board. Let the mortar dry for 24 hours then test the shower. With that said, the key benefits of Kerdi Board include: While cement board may be the most common and widely-known tile substrate, Kerdi Board is giving it a run for its money. Browse other questions tagged, Start here for a quick overview of the site, Detailed answers to any questions you might have, Discuss the workings and policies of this site. GoBoard is a kind of backer board because the main elements of a backer board are cement, silica, fiberglass, etc. Do new devs get fired if they can't solve a certain bug? Seems like I've been using the full measure of water the bag calls for, plus about 10%.-50 lbs of thinset at a time is too much for an amatuer. And we are using a drippy mixture, it slides off the trowel. The most important thing to remember when applying the membrane over the cement board is to make sure the surface is clean and free of any debris, dust or other contaminants. Kerdi really offers very little advantage over hardiboard plus membrane. The core isnt waterproof, but it can withstand getting wet without falling apart, so even if your waterproofing system leaks, the board will stay intact. Caulk the gap. The main issue caused by non-waterproof cement boards is the eventual warping and damage to the tiles, making it difficult and costly to fix without removing all the tile and starting over. To learn more, see our tips on writing great answers. How do you show the depth of a hole in a drawing? If you want a cement board, use Durock or Wonderboard. Stack Exchange network consists of 181 Q&A communities including Stack Overflow, the largest, most trusted online community for developers to learn, share their knowledge, and build their careers. You still use metal lath, but then mix bags of powder and pour the soupy mix onto the floor. Ditra is a 1/8-inch thick polyethylene membrane with a layer of anchoring fleece on the underside and a grid of square cavities on top. Kerdi can be installed first on drywall or cement board. An additional layer of sealant can also be applied on the seams for extra protection and water resistance. Site design / logo 2023 Stack Exchange Inc; user contributions licensed under CC BY-SA. Kerdi on shower curbs - JLC-Online Forums You provide the pitch during the tile set. When it comes to tile underlayment, your options can be categorized into three main classifications, each suitable for different tiling circumstances: Although cement board is the most commonly used underlayment for tile, Kerdi board is growing in popularity as a multifunctional tile substrate. Schulter Ditra is manufactured by Schluter Systems and is a 1/8 thick polyethylene uncoupling membrane that is specifically designed for tile installations. . Can You Put RedGard On HardieBacker Board? - Next Modern Home Kerdi membrane can be used on cement board, drywall, and, as you may have guessed- greenboard. That means that you do not have to rely on a surface membrane or worry about the board failing if the core is exposed to water. They are square. In . Step 3: Apply Thinset. Installation is simple- just trowel a layer of thin-set adhesive on the floor and embed the mat in it, then fill the cavities with thin-set. #1 - Backer board has nothing to do with HD or any other big box. Cement board is readily available and relatively inexpensive (about $10 for a 3 x 5-ft. sheet). With Kerdi Board you get to enjoy an effective product that is lightweight, easy to cut, waterproof, and leaves behind no dust! As fiber cement board is similar to regular cement board, it makes sense to choose the one that is cheaper or more readily available. The big issue with cement board is that the thinset will skin over really quickly. I would fear leaks in all corners of this shower. First, felt paper is stapled to the floor and covered with expanded metal lath. However, a cement board is generally easier and less expensive to replace if a repair is needed. How should I transition between cement board floor and alcove tub? Like the example above. We tried adding water to the thinset, we tried using a larger notch trowel, but nothing seems to make the Kerdi stick. Problem with very thick cement board/ tile/bullnose edge, Steam Shower Slip Joint Detail - The secret is in the boarding stage. We were using a 3/16 x 5/32 trowel, probably to small. Making statements based on opinion; back them up with references or personal experience. Also - use a good thinset. Finally, make sure to select a thinset that is appropriate for the job, check the manufacturers recommendation, and always follow the instructions on the product label. Well, DH said he had virtually no time to work with the stuff before it dried out, so he switched from my spritz bottle to a sponge. As such, many homeowners and professionals find themselves wondering whether Kerdi Board or cement board is the better tile substrate. To get the most protection from the cement board, it should be installed in a way that ensures it is waterproof, in addition to being secured properly with the right adhesive and screws. Is it ok to fasten a shower surround to Schluter Kerdi curb? However, the answer you provided above suggests that the OP could omit a waterproof membrane, that I. En cliquant sur Accepter , j'accepte l'utilisation des cookies telle qu'elle est dcrite plus en dtail dans la Politique d'Utilisation des Cookies de Houzz. It is a topical waterproofing layer that is put over the substrate to keep water from getting to the wood frame and nails. FRC board tends to be more moisture-resistant than gypsum board and is best suited for outdoor projects such as showers or tub surrounds. It is also widely available and a relatively inexpensive option approximately $10 for a 3-foot by 5-foot sheet. Once the primer is completely dry, use a roller or brush to apply a coat of your chosen KERDI membrane adhesive over the entire surface of the wall, overlapping the edges slightly for full coverage. One thing I do like fibercement (Hardie) for is when I need thin strips of cement board. Bathroom closets are often catch-alls for anything and everything remotely related to self-care. To create a watertight shower assembly, we installed Schluter's Kerdi membrane over the drywall, just as we would for tile.Write by:. Kerdi-Board is an extruded polystyrene foam panel, with reinforcing material on both sides, covered by fleece webbing for effective anchoring of thin-set mortar. Do you have any pictures? Mike Holmes uses backer on his show. They can be installed on any type of support and can even be used to create partitions, with no structural support required. The drywall's back side fails, and it's just as bad or worse than it was on the tile side. Here are the fundamentals of tile installation over cement board. This will help protect the cement board from water damage, and is often a specific type of coating designed for use with cement boards. Most cement-based thin-set mortars are suitable; however, it is important to check the manufacturers instructions to ensure that the product is approved for use with Schluter systems. LONDON. I set the Kerdi with my hands, pat it into the thinset with my hands, then go over it with a 4" taping knife held at a low angle to embed the Kerdi in the thinset. One of the company says they are going to apply kerdi membrane on the drywall, then tiles onto the kerdi membrane, and as such as cement backboard would not be required. Any recommendations? One of the major benefits of opting for Kerdi Board over cement board is the ease of installation. This will include installing its components, such as drain plate and drain collar, as well as Kerdi Band for further protection of seams and corners. Step 7: Cut the Tile. Step 4: Place the Tile. It is important to seal any imperfections in the drywall to ensure a long-lasting installation and to minimize water infiltration. Anytime Mongo. #4 You could be adding a good 1000 pounds to your install too. While cement board may be the most common and widely-known tile substrate, Kerdi Board is giving it a run for its money. We installed cement board on the walls, and today when we attempted to apply the Kerdi membrane we could not get it to adhere. Do the prefab Schluter niches like the double unit 12 by 28shelf have a built in pitch to the bottom and middle shelves to drainoff water as shown in niche that you built in that thread? Schluter Ditra VS Cement Board (Which is better?) If you are looking for a way to minimize height buildup and eliminate a large level difference at thresholds, a mat product is a good solution. We recommend our users to update the browser. Its important to note that Kerdi membrane is not a structural base layer, so plywood should be installed and reinforced as necessary based on load requirements. Sweeby-Can you clarify- I undestood that the thinset would tend to dry out from the thirsty hardi or skim over from the air; so how does booking the Kerdi help with the first? Too little, and the kerdi will never show you gray, no matter how you sweat. We are still most comfortable with full plumber's pan over the curb, including glue-on preformed corners, and also a second layer (usually Kerdi but can be paint-on) on top of CBU wrap over curb. 120 sq feet including the floor. Whether youre installing tile on a floor, wall, or countertop, choosing the right type of substrate, or underlayment, is critical to preventing breaks and cracks in both the tile and the grout. Learn more about Stack Overflow the company, and our products. When I do another shower I'll use real cement board, not Hardi-board. In general, modified thin-set mortar is not recommended to set ceramic and stone tile, including large format tiles, over the KERDI membrane. Properly waterproofed Hardie board should last for many years. Maybe try another brand of thinset? Home Improvement Stack Exchange is a question and answer site for contractors and serious DIYers. Make sure to use multiple coats, if necessary. The great thing about Kerdi Board is that it is lightweight and easier to maneuver. Using cement board and a sheet membrane . the cost of the tile job. Kerdi is also used as shower lining, as required in IRC Section P2709.2 and IPC Section 417.5.2, over concrete, mortar, tile backerboard, expanded polystyrene foam board, prefabricated polystyrene shower trays, curb and ramp, gypsum board and masonry substrates." So, you can choose what board you want in your shower when using Kerdi. Ready to join the 100,000+ homeowners matched with pros? liquid waterproofing (redgard) over durock cement board - bathroom HardieBacker with Hydrodefense instead of Kerdi Board? : r/DIY - reddit But a mortar bed does have advantages. When installed, Kerdi Board creates a substrate that is level, flat, square, plumb, and dimensionally stable. Houzz Pro: One simple solution for contractors and design pros, surfer thanked Avanti Tile & Stone / Stonetech. (3ft-3in wide)Or will the Kerdi membrane (with seams taped with kerdi band) prevent each board from moving . You can apply it on PVC, metal, slabs, walls, and floors. Yes, you should prime drywall before installing KERDI in order to ensure proper adhesion and a successful installation. All shower/tub areas should have concrete board (I prefer hardiboard). However, you do still have to take care to waterproof the seams and the fastener penetrations to create a waterproof assembly. It is designed to form a waterproof layer between cement board and tiles, helping create a watertight installation. Kerdi membrane is a waterproofing material that is designed to be used in wet areas such as bathrooms and showers before tiles are installed. Yeah it seems that the only products that will be compatible with cement board and the kerdi membrane are bostik ditra-set and schluter all-set (or one of schluters other products). We think it is the cement board (Durock) sucking the moisture out of the unmodified thinset. Porcelain and ceramic tiles are stiff and hard materials, so if they are installed on an unlevel or bouncy surface they are highly susceptible to cracking. Ditra is manufactured in a 3'3 width and comes in various roll lengths (54sf, 150sf, and 323 sf). New England. Please feel free to reach out to our Product Support Team at 1-800-992-6273 if you need anything. Installation instructions vary depending on the type of Kerdi membrane being used, but typically the membrane is applied directly to a clean, dry plywood surface that is free from dust, dirt, and other debris. Once its applied, the last step is to follow up the waterproof coating with a waterproof sealant. Once all that is completed and the Aquadefense has dried, you can install your tile with a polymer modified mortar meeting the ANSI requirements of A118.4 or A118.11. Hi.I have a unique situation. This means that even if your waterproofing system leaks, the cement board will remain intact. Then you can apply a thin layer of KERDI-FIX to the board, the membrane over top, and use a rolling pin to press it down and ensure a secure bond. Need help liner vs liquid membrane question. I simply sponge off the excess. Plus, if you use the mold and moisture resistant drywall, it will be extra insurance against mold. Building Panel: Price $ 119 00 $ 202 06 $ 279 00. . The tub flange can really be a pain in the butt when installing a tile tub surround. The Kerdi-Line prefab pans and drains make me feel way more comfortable with the waterproofing. For the floor I make a dry mix mud base and then the Kerdi membrane. The Ditra uncoupling design is lightweight, durable, and minimizes the possibility of cracked tile and grout. That's the way us "Tile Guys" do it all the time. Also, apply the acrylic mastic between the Create curved designs around pipes or columns using the vertically-grooved KERDI-BOARD-V, or use L-shaped KERDI-BOARD-E panels to enclose similar. Once you have determined the type of thinset, its important to also consider the weather conditions during installation. Anyone who has done more than 1 shower shouldn't start without knowing that. By clicking Accept all cookies, you agree Stack Exchange can store cookies on your device and disclose information in accordance with our Cookie Policy. Connect and share knowledge within a single location that is structured and easy to search. Preparing drywall for KERDI membrane requires a few important steps to ensure a successful application. Kerdi Questions and Answers - Kennedy Kitchens & Baths 3. It only takes a minute to sign up. Waterproofing is an important aspect of any bathroom or wet-area installation. Keep in mind, that, just to be safe, most professionals choose to install a waterproofing membrane on top of the cement board when installing in wet locations like tub surrounds or showers. Why are Suriname, Belize, and Guinea-Bissau classified as "Small Island Developing States"? The thickness of the tile is important, and should be known, but not because it changes the method of building. After priming, use an approved adhesive to adhere the KERDI membrane to the drywall, making sure the edges are well sealed and joints are tight.if(typeof ez_ad_units!='undefined'){ez_ad_units.push([[468,60],'remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4','ezslot_12',156,'0','0'])};__ez_fad_position('div-gpt-ad-remodelormove_com-medrectangle-4-0'); A successful installation of KERDI requires well-prepared surfaces and a proper application, so take the time to properly prime the drywall before installation. I would avoid Hardi, as Avanti is right that it is thirsty. Then you can apply a thin layer of KERDI-FIX to the board, the membrane over top . Also are you saying that you wet ("booking the Kerdi") the Kerdi, as well? Plus, most self-leveling formulas harden very fast, so you have to plan carefully so you can mix and pour quickly. All shower/tub areas should have concrete board (I prefer hardiboard). Though, each product comes with its own individual characteristics, and pros and cons.

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